Faith Based on Love Not Fear (Joshua Tongol)

Saturday, January 12, 2013

My friend Joshua Tongol just made a new video on the critical difference between basing your faith on love instead of fear.

Really, really, good stuff. Give it a watch:


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8 Comments:

At 9:13 AM, Blogger Unknown said...

The new testament message is not based of Love it is based on Fear. Even the great Paul in one of the greatest chapters regarding the reconciliation and sharing the message of reconciliation couches the whole thing not just on Fear.. but Terror.

2 cor 5:11 "11 Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men;

The Greek word there is Phobos. Which we know is used to day to define a mental condition that underlies having an irrational out of control terror of something and phobia. The idea is "flee in terror" this idea is plastered all over the new testament from Mathew to Revelation. Do a word study on how many times this word is used and how and when its used. In this chapter on reconciliation alone Its used as the entire underpinning of the argument. Even though later in the same chapter paul says that Christ has reconciled the kosmos.. in effect that really means nothing. The internal conflicted contradictions in thought warring against itself is never mor4e clear than in this chapter.

Fortunately for mankind the real creator has nothing to do with a being called Yahweh.

 
At 1:11 PM, Anonymous Derek said...

Unknown,

You've left several comments now, and I appreciate that you've been through a hurtful experience with fundamentalism. I share your concerns with violence, and affirm that asking questions and challenging hurtful things is good. That's all very positive.

However what you are doing here is not good. Here you are on a blog that promotes thinking and asking questions, nonviolence, grace... and specifically a post about breaking away from fear, and you are trying your darnedest to invalidate it, to say "no that's not what Christianity is about, it's about fear and hurt!"

You are attacking people who really should be your allies, and in the process you are doing the very things that hurt you in the first place to us: you are being extremist and intolerant and judgmental.

The position you are taking is that the fundamentalists have got it right, and us progressive Christians who are focused on social justice and compassion have got it wrong. We have it wrong that fundies are right. I have news for you: fundamentalists are wrong. They misrepresent Jesus.

Again, I think we have a lot in common, but I'm going to lay it out for you: This is a no hate zone, and what you are doing is not cool. This is my blog and I get to make the rules, and my rule is I have zero patience for people being toxic. So pull it together and conduct yourself with respect and empathy or you'll find yourself banned from posting here.

 
At 5:11 PM, Blogger Unknown said...

You are reading what I am posting about ideas and personalizing into people. You are not what you believe you are you. What you think or believe can change but the essence of who you are as a person does not change.

Yes I am challenging what you may believe just as I have been challenged with what I believe. But I am only doing that by presenting a statement or idea that can be critiqued, examined, accepted or rejected. I am not a fundamentalist nor any kind of Christian in a classic sense any longer. I am a spiritualist who has a long history of teaching the bible.

The point is I agree with you in principle and philosophy all I am saying is you can no find our philosophy in the bible other than a random accidental verse.

The real value of real genuine Love is not that two walk together in agreement but that two can walk together in disagreement.

 
At 8:43 AM, Blogger Aceofspades said...

Hi Unknown

Perhaps there is a place for fear in Christianity, but I don't believe that this fear means what you think it does.

Personally, my fear of God is based on my love for God.

I fear God in the same way that a loving child might fear disappointing their parents.

I fear God because I realise that he has an enormously high standard for me and I want to live up to that as best I can because I love him.

I don't fear that God will strike me dead or send me to hell. I trust that he is good and kind and compassionate and loving and long suffering and merciful. But I do fear that I might take these things for granted.

God's compassion, love and mercy are not only present in "random accidental verses", but rather they are central to the character of Jesus and so too to the character of God.

 
At 11:45 AM, Blogger Samurai said...

Hi Derek,
I've been following your posts avidly since a year or two ago, and really enjoyed your book "Healing the Gospel." I'm looking forward to seeing many more works published. However, I must confess I haven't followed the responses and comments as closely.

It's for the latter reason that I hope you won't take the following comments as rebuke so much as an honest curiosity when I read your response to "Unknown." I don't know the history of what "Unknown" has been posting - perhaps some of it has been more polarizing or hurtful than the one above.

I realize one has to set healthy limits on certain situations, but your answer came across as unusually harsh on first pass and I'm wondering what's behind this uncharacteristically strong response. In particular, I was struck by your asking him/her to "pull it together and conduct yourself with respect and empathy or you'll find yourself banned."

Peace.

 
At 10:07 PM, Anonymous Derek said...

Samurai,

"Unknown" had posted multiple comments here, so it would be important to have read them all to get the full context. I can see how reading just this one in isolation you might not see the toxicity that I was seeing.

Generally my comment policy is quite similar to that of Rachel Held Evans:
"Comment Policy: Please stay positive with your comments. If your comment is rude, it gets deleted. If it is critical, please make it constructive. If you are constantly negative or a general ass, troll, or hater, you will get banned. The definition of terms is left solely up to us."

In this case, I did not feel it was appropriate to delete the posts, however I did want to make it very clear that I expect this to be a safe space where people show respect to each other. As I myself write for some major outlets (Washington Post, Huffington Post, etc.) and so I see how out of hand and ugly comments sections can get firsthand. Sometimes folks from there spill over to here, and so I need to make clear that the rules here are very different.

I suppose I could have said it more nicely. I guess I was triggered a bit. But I do stand by the content of what I said, and the desire to keep this blog space civil and constructive.

 
At 5:39 AM, Blogger Samurai said...

Thank you for the helpful response (and the time you took to write one!). Folks tend to get rougher on blogs, where they can hide behind the screen and not have to look the other person in the eye. So I totally get what you're saying.

 
At 10:33 AM, Blogger WholesaleToyo@gmail.com said...

Unknown are your initials AVDM? Just curious.

 

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